By The seller of this Corvette seems to be pretty upfront about his find, he even admits he’s flipping it. The car has issues that need to be addressed to get it running, namely a bad water pump. It also had its original 4 speed swapped out for an automatic, thankfully though there is a Muncie 4 speed and all the parts to switch it back included with the car. I love the blue on blue paint scheme, although I’m not too sure about a previous owner’s special touches out back. This could be a wonderful spring project, but you’ll just have to take a closer look at it and decide for yourself! I don’t mind that the seller is flipping this Corvette, I’m just glad to see it out of the barn and hopefully on its way to a new life.
I do wish the seller had cleaned it up a little and installed the water pump. Changing the transmission it a bit more of an involved task, so I understand him not doing that, but installing the water pump and getting it running is something one could easily do in an evening. And in the end it would give buyers considerably more confidence knowing that the engine isn’t seized and is running.
When sellers don’t fix little things like this, it makes me wonder why they haven’t done the work. Is it laziness (I can actually understand that one a little better) or is it that they fear what they might find? If the car was parked because of a bad water pump, does that mean the engine overheated?
If that’s the case it could mean damage to the internals, leaving us to just hope that nothing was damaged and that it really will be a simple project to get running. Let’s move on from the speculation though and focus on what we can see. First off, the body looks good. I don’t see any body damage and the seller claims they don’t see any rust on the frame. The paint is an issue for me and not just because of the custom touches, but because it looks to be coming off in a few areas.
The front half actually doesn’t look to bad and might just clean up nicely. The worst of the problems are on the rear clip, which has the custom work and paint popping off. If you are good with body work and blending paint, you might be able to redo the back and have it looking pretty good. Of course, you could just leave it as is and just enjoy it as is! I’m blown away by how much C2 Corvettes are going for these days, but having had the joy of riding in several I can understand the appeal. This one is going to need a decent amount of work to get it to top value, but personally I would focus more on making it an enjoyable car to drive and if it adds value in the end it would just be a nice bonus! I’d clean it up, get the 4 speed in there, get the engine running great, install new tires, and clean the interior up the best I could without replacing everything.
So what would you guys do with this Corvette? Would you give it a full restoration or just what’s necessary to make it a fun driver? I pray you never become disabled like myself, spinal cord injury and a degenerative nerve disease. Only people who have never had any real challenges to their lives or lost any freedoms would spout such a mouthful of crap. I’m trying to be polite. I’ve switched all my cars to automatics and drive with hand controls. A shift kit, the right torque converter and internals it even shifts harder than the 4spd.
The drag car is consistently faster as well. I’d like to still be able run up stairs and row the Toploader in my Torino but I’ll take what I can get. Hey buddy, think first. I too was kind of wondering if that comment was going to come back to haunt him.
Id also like to apologize and express support for anyone who does whatever they can to survive trauma and Injury. Im a veteran as well (Air Force) and my family all the way back to the Continental Army served. (Just documented some of that). So, the comments about Vietnam and Corvettes got me thinking, My pal Hal, Interesting guy, Never served in the military per se, But he took a job as a Diver (Deep sea hard hat certified) in the harbors of Vietnam looking for booby traps and mines. As dirty as Some harbors are, add in the nerve wracking aspects of IED & EOD work and many a lessor person would crumble.
After return to the US 1968-69 or so? He went and bought a Corvette from the Chevy dealership on 82nd ave here in Portland. He got pulled over by a Portland cop and he told us he could still see the dealerships sign in the rear view mirror in the distance.
Cop asked him “You just buy this?” “Yep” Cop told him “I dont think this is going to work out for you”. While I didnt buy anything new when I came back from the Military I had a similar series of incidents with the Troutdale Police where i was staying.
(Welcome home A.H.) But my buddy Hals Story is much better than mine. As to what we did to cars when they were relatively new, and not collectible or what we did when we were young should always be viewed in a certain light. Its easy to complain or point fingers now much later.
Doug thanks for responding and I’d like to apologize for snapping, in the last 4yrs I’ve had my life change drastically and have learned what people like myself (and I’m grateful I still am mobile) have to deal with daily. The smallest things can take so much time, short distances can seem like miles to walk and a flight of stairs is the equivalent of climbing Mount Everest. I kick myself for the times I used to park in a handicap spot cause it was easy not thinking the people it was meant for really needed it.
Time for dinner, carry on. Something fishy here.
First off, another flipper who is too lazy to push the thing out of the garage and wash it. Also, since no title, the flipper can’t do it the legal way and put the car in his name and pay the dmv fees and taxes right? The car looks like it will clean up nice and bid even higher if cleaned, title or not. I wonder why he did not bring the car home and clean it up? Why is it still in the same garage where he found it. Hmm, lost title?
I guess it could be possible that somebody is going to come looking for this car. It’s not only the so called missing title needed in order to put the car on the road that is a problem, without proof of ownership, anyone can come along and say that it’s their car. Now, they may not be able to prove this but they can sure make alot of trouble in the process.
How does a title go missing? If the car is still in the legal owner’s hands, he can get a new title, if he is gone, his estate can also get a new title issued. The only way a title can not be reissued is if something is really wrong, such as the legal owner not knowing about it.
Maybe there is a lien on the car too.Whoever still has that title in their hands and under their name of this car is the owner. Boy, no coffee today? Your getting twisted cause the guy is flipping a 51yr old vette but he’s not changing the water pump!! That car looks like it’s a solid foundation for a restoration or whatever but its been ridden hard and put away wet.
Its not numbers match anymore so have at it. When I’ve flipped cars I either clean and sell as is and tell the buyer I didn’t do anything except get it to roll or I’ll go through everything and make sure it runs and drives well. Replacing the pump may start a chain of events that can get costly, pump, thermostat, radiator, hoses maybe head gasket. It’s up to him, no one is forcing anyone to buy it. Clear title is, for me, the only way to buy any car.
Without it, you have no idea what may turn up after you have paid for it – at worst, it could even be a set-up to get your money and then have a friend of the seller take back the car. This should be corrected by the seller before money changes hands. There is lots to do on this car before it will be worth $50K and we have no idea how high the reserve might be- until we know the reserve it is impossible to judge how good a deal it might be. IMHO it is getting to the fair value limit soon. I just looked at Feebay and its at $25.5k and i see NO reserve on it. If its FeeBay never rules out hanky panky, and expect all kinds of shill bidding and other stuff.
Who cares as long as you pay for it what you are comfortable with. If you guys think there isnt screwy stuff going on at other selling venues you are rather naive.
The point is, know your market, Know the product and do your research. I also love it when I was buying and selling when a seller had a distressed sale. In most cases i DO NOT want you working on it.
Many people just make it worse. Titles dont worry me. I run numbers and due dilligence. Im not giving away all my tricks but I have never been burned yet. I realize in many states titles ARE a problem. But for every problem there is a solution. As to the car itself, Im knowledgeable only in a general sense on Vettes but a expert or purist would pick this one apart.
Lots not correct or stock, but that being said, after an inspection and research this seems like a good deal. As to a Fluff and Buff resto on this, No way, This car is a can of worms. This will be an indepth project stem to stern.
But for the right guy, you could do really well with it doing a make over and selling for big money, Or as a foundation for your keeper dream car it looks pretty good from the cheap seats over here. Oh yes, to whoever said you cant export this without a title, WRONG. You can, there is steps to do it. Can you ship without ANY paperwork or documentation? But there are ways to ship without titles.
Most countries and customs like the title because here in the US that is a legal standard WE use. Other countries use variations. I have shipped to India.
Japan, Germany, England, Scotland, Australia and New Zealand. I have also imported from many of these same countries. Dont rely on the first freight broker you talk to either.
Many as a company have their own procedures or standards. Doesnt mean something cannot be done. Recipe for a stolen car? People dont lose paperwork? Sorry buddy, you must not have dealt with any estate situations, Or dealt with the species Human much.
I have worked for 3 different govt agencies and you ASSUME they have their acts together, but jeez, some of the people I have worked with should make you afraid, very afraid. My dad was an Atty for 55 years. I was asked to assist in MANY estate situations, as well as a “Expert” for firearms, certain types of collectibles, tools, Vehicles from Motorcycles, cars to Airplanes. I volunteer and do promotional work for a well known museum and in that role we are asked on a monthly basis to advise, do appraisals and evaluate collections and estate situations. My BIL has worked for a high end auction house for 35 years that specializes in estate auctions and collectibles. The stories we could spill would boggle your mind. Live WW11 Munitions when cleaning out a old guys house.
Found a 1964 Honda with 23 miles on the odometer buried under debris in the garage the family didnt even know they owned. A well known guy here local, not once, not twice but three times was found $20,000, $33,000 and $39,000 in Gold and Silver Coins and Bullion the guy stashed away and forgot about. Thats just what was found. God knows how much got away, stolen or tossed. I could go on and on.
Okay, Sweet Vette! So, im not giving away all my secrets but heres a freebie to get your guys thinking outside the box a bit. Remember buy low sell high. Also sell whats IN demand in markets WHERE there is demand.
So the following is not exactly a secret in my area. We have a huge swap meet coming up in April here in Portland Oregon.
Biggest in the Western part of the US. Spend some time looking at investment cars and watch the buyers with money belts and bulging pockets. Listen for accents. You will see Asians and a lot of Ozzies and Kiwis. Certain American Muscle cars are bank $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ So, just for a little education spend some time trolling here for example Corvettes listed on TRADEME.NZ See: Or look up vehicles, cars or motorcycles on the website yourself.
See: Check out some of the listings. Now, you gotta line up a freight broker or know a shipper. I have guys who share containers. You also need a guy on the ground over there. Oz, NZ, Japan, etc But all the big events here on the west coast, Especially the California events theres a LOT of “FURRIGNERS” spending filthy lucre. Some people get mad at this.
Ive been yelled at for selling overseas. Heck, I always say.”I dont tell them were ALL the good stuff is, C’mon!” My buddy hauled a trailer load of vintage bikes to a SoCal meet and he had people thrusting wads of cash into his Hands Sold all his stuff in the first hour. I have a friend who came over from the UK last fall. When questioned at the Airport “Sir, Are you bringing in any amounts of cash?” Theres signs at all the entry points that large sums MUST be declared.
Steve thought about lying, and losing the $40,000 in his money belt and decided honesty was best. Declared it, Was questioned extensively.
It was funny because Customs didnt seem to know what to do about him. Super cool guy but when asked, “Look Laddy, I’ve bought motorcycles here in the US I am picking up and purchasing more, Does this look like a face you are going to accept a Cheque from? So, Cash it is!” Cant argue with that. The real Irony is, despite so many Ozzies coming over and buying up our junk, Ive imported stuff FROM there, and I know Americans who travel around over there scooping up stuff to ship back here to the US. Early American Motorcycle parts and bikes are often exported from Australia here to the US. So, lot of stuff crossing the ponds.
And NO, Im not giving up my contacts overseas. Doug these are excellent points. I too export mainly to mainland Europe, and yes you will get guys pissed at you about sending cars overseas. My reply usually is “well then outbid them!”. Pretty simple. You are totally correct about supply and demand for an area. I’m on the east coast and, rust factors aside, we have very few good trucks out here.
But tons of 50’s-70’s imports. Western US is the opposite: tons of solid, cheap trucks, few imports few Mustangs. I send trucks over here to the East Coast and Mustangs over there to the west coast. Use an LLC to offset shipping costs & come out ahead 9 times outta 10. Hey, everyone, just CHILL!
I spent the first 28 years of my life in N.Y. There was NO SUCH THING as a “title” for any vehicle until 1974. Just a little green registration card. It is NO problem to apply for a new registration, simply by providing the VIN on an application at the DMV. (However, that in itself is a problem, as the line at any given N.Y. DMV office usually stretches the distance relative to that between goal lines on a football field.) When I moved from N.Y. To TN., a friend trailered down a ’34 Ford 5 window that he thought I would like to have.
I took the registration card to the County Clerk’s office and she asked “Where’s the title?” I explained that N.Y. Didn’t issue titles back in the day, so she went in the back, checked with her supervisor, gave me a temporary registration paper, and I received a shiny blue Tennessee title in the mail a month or so thereafter Ok. Pontification over. I’ve checked two ways, I have a friend who is a police officer and if I supply a full vin, I have an answer usually within 24hrs, it’s not a database available to the public, I’ve asked! I’ve also gone into my local DMV on the information line with the vin and said I’m buying this car and would like to be sure the person I’m buying from actually owns it, they tell me the last known owners last name, state of registration and if it’s listed as stolen.
Nothing else. Usually they ask me to step aside and wait, 15-20 minutes isn’t too long to avoid a lifetime of grief. Hope this helps. Jim, and Dave you are both correct, If you can find a friendly officer to run one, and helps if you are known as a legit vehicle guy, I have done this many times.
But not all police will do it either. It helps when you have ID working for the same Govt agency and have done it also when i worked for the county. Same deal, “Im looking at 2 vehicles off of CL, can you run these for me. Check for Liens and Stolen”. I used to do it as a walk in at the DMV, but here in Oregon they changed the laws. (Will explain in a minute) So, ALSO, BUILD a relationship with your friendly neighborhood insurance agent. One of my renters worked for a big company, and she knew i was legit and careful and would run vehicles and even helped with a few background checks i needed.
Dont abuse it and works fine. But if you deal in vehicles and are known, you should have a relationship with an agent. (Bought yours on the internet? Sucks to be you) So, my agent will from time to time run stuff for me. ALL Insurance agents and companies are linked in and have access.
However EVERY log in is tracked and in some cases it costs the subscriber (Banks, Ins. Private investigator, OGA) for every lookup or log in.
So, better use discretion. I have a few clerks I try to deal with. They know me and we have built up trust.
However it USED to be all DMV records were public records. That was changed due to a stalker/Murder (TV actress Rebecca Schaefer?) She had a stalker her in Oregon get her DMV info and allowed him to walk up to her house in Calif and shot her. Laws changed. People just dont hand over all the details but you CAN ask “Can you confirm or deny this vehicle has liens, any other encumbrances or reported stolen in recent history?” You can also ask open ended questions like “Is there more than one title holder?” IE: Business partner or spouse Co-signer or owner You could also ask “Is there any recent history on this such as Inquiries or pending changes/Transactions?” You can also HIRE a private investigator. Might be worth it for some situations. I wont give away everything here but you might want background info on possible lien holders, extended family who might come out of the woodwork later, PIs are almost always retired or former law enforcement and a good one can be a real asset.
For a high end collectible this can be a solid investment for you. For a Vette thats potentially huge money whats a few hundred dollars? My dad used to tell people all the time, “If you hired a lawyer before you did something you wouldnt need one after the fact and it would have been a LOT less money” This apply’s to all kinds of things in life.
I will add, I sold a vintage Triumph motorcycle to a buyer in Washington. The frame and motor were non-matching but the motor number already had 2 titles associated with it in 2 different states. While we had physical possession of the actual motor, the matching frame was being used in one state with the title, and someone somewhere used that same number and got a title and was titled in another state. I sent off letters to both states and my documentation, its a long story but the point is these things happen. People also sell PAPER. Selling of titles without posession of the vehicle is illegal in many places, but it still happens.
I saw 2 classifieds this morning for people selling paper. (IE: TITLES) For a high end valuable vehicle, certain numbers are in demand. The joke is T120 TT model Triumphs were made approx 2000 per year for each year made (mid 60s) Far more plain jane T120 or T120R models were built.
The joke is now there are approx 10,000 TT Triumphs per year in existence. So, fake numbers exist, restamps happen, and sometimes vehicles get parted out and the serial and VIN numbers get reused on multiple vehicles. Thats is why you do your research, consult with experts (Not all of whom are always correct) and do your due dilligence.
A vehicle with Provenance is something you always want to value highly. Perhaps you can create that provenance. I do this all the time. You can consult with Marque experts, get appraisals, Get evaluations. Many Clubs have machine dating and certification.
(many of my vintage bikes are certified this way, prevents frauds from using my numbers and building a knock off) You can track down its history. Family photos, old dealer records, service records, receipts. Insurance paperwork. You might be amazed what you can come up with. Now, older vehicles had some weird stuff. This is where research and Marque experts can be a resource.
Cops and DMVs, and Insurance companies also have books showing this material and what a VIN looked like and where to look. Keep in mind the following in some jurisdictions heres what some LE operate off of: #### ANY INDICATION A VIN NUMBER IS ALTERED OR MISREPRESENTED IS CAUSE FOR SEIZURE###### Scary right?
I know 2 attorneys who represented clients who had motorcycles and 1 car impounded and in one case the cops held them for 5 years before release. Guilty until proven innocent. It took a lawsuit to get them released. Familiarize yourself with “PREPONDERANCE OF EVIDENCE” So, Just because an expert offers an opinion doesnt mean they know what they are talking about. For example some of my vehicles have a 3 digit VIN # and one has 2 digits.
This freaks people out and makes some of their heads explode. I just tell them what they SHOULD have been told in training. To match the modern 17 digit Vin system add an appropriate amount of Zeros. While I consult often in valuations and machine dating, And despite my credentials, Sometimes its easier to show them a printed book.
Roy Bacons “Triumph twins restoration guide” and the pages highlighted where it says “VIN numbers are rarely neat and orderly on these machines. They were hand stamped and ones that look too tidy should be viewed with suspicion” Its fun to see the looks on Police and DMV clerks when you hand over documentation like that. Not so much when you go in and “Well, Doug said”. Titles are deffinatly an in exact science. My 58 Mercedes has title with the model number as the vin. I asked the DMV about it, they looked it up and said there were 2 others in the state with the same number.all good Idaho titles. I have not addressed it officially to them yet but will fix it one day.
It seems to me that most of the timeas long as you are not trying to do something illegal, immoral or unethical it can be fixed. In the old days there were a lot of Hummers around without titles, most got a Chevrolet Pickup title calling it home built or modified. There is more to the story but that is the bottom line. Doug you laid it all out perfect. I’d like to add something I ran into yrs ago. In the early eighties a guy I did a lot of work for went out of business(due to divorce, he had a cheap lawyer, she had a big gun). He had no cash available and signed over to me three motorcycles out of his collection.
No antiques, just used bikes that all needed something. I found two were Hondas that were registered by the vin stamped on the head of the frame, the Harley was registered by the serial number on the engine case, there was also a different number on the frame. I spent a lot of time trying to find out what to do, there was no internet and DMV then was a nightmare. After weeks I was able to find out the number on the frame had never been used or registered, even Harley Davidson wasn’t much help but said some bikes had different numbers. I ultimately sold it to a mechanic at Harley Davidson dealer who was a helping me. My dad had been a Police officer and worked for the auto squad and two vins was a big red flag to me.
I don’t know if that’s a common issue but wanted to mention it. Jim, this is EXACTLY what I am talking about when I said a expert is often needed for older vehicles. The rules also changed many times. On the Harley, It USED to be all HDs were registered and titled by what was known as the “Belly Numbers” and that changed.
Stolen Gun Serial Number Lookup
Also, many people title and register by the VIN on the frame, regardless of motor. Logically motors might end up being replaced so that makes sense but not everyone follows those rules today. Some manufacturers had different numbers on a motor and frame and while a club dating officer or certificate can verify that “This 1962 BSA 500cc Goldstar was completed in Aug 1961 and was exported to Hap Alzina Western US importer and left the factory with Frame # CB32 4038 and Engine # DBD 5016 with a STD transmission with # 786234 with standard gearing and lighting equipment” Now, then you have a Washington state title that states its a 1964 BSA 650 (Which is a twin cylinder) and Titled off the frame number. It was titled as a 64 because that was the year of the sale and registration. When I come across it it has the wrong Engine (a 1955 small fin) and the owner is representing it as all stock and correct.
So, it pays to do your research. Much easier now days with the internet but i can point you to forums where the president and a guy who should know better of the International Triumph Owners club declared several bikes as phonies and no such machines ever existed. He was proved wrong with extensive documentation. So even the best sometimes get things wrong.
I have brand new NOS engine cases from dealer inventorys. NO VIN NUMBERs. I have access to other NOS dealer inventory. We have replaced frames, and engines for shop customers many times and restamped VIN numbers. I did this at several shops.
Wont do anything illegal but here in Oregon a legit way of doing this exists and many times I write letters to DMVs to document this. I will say I know some car guys who i know have stamps, and create phonies. Some are well known nationally. Im not in the business of busting people, But I dont approve of making fakes or deceiving people. But it DOES happen. My ex wife’s cousin was a really high end machinest and welder in Rosemead California. I remember one time some “guys” brought him a mold for I think the right side engine case for a Harley.
It had been damaged at the factory and discarded.some enterprising soul had taken it home. It wound up in the Rosemead shop to be repaired. The “guys” we’re really excited because they wanted to make engine cases without serial numbers. It seems the Harlies of the time only had a serial number on the case that the mold was for. The “guys” gave him a 1000.00 cash tip for doing a great job, that was in the early 70’s. There are several websites that explain the Harley numbering system. 1909 to 1930 was a real mess to figure things out.
Prior to 1970 Harley frames didnt have a VIN number. Yes, the cases prior to 70 had a left side stamping, but you also verify what it is with the belly numbers.
There are several tricks to verify if numbers have been welded over and restamped. A expert can even retrieve previously stamped numbers if you know what you are doing. ( A bit of chemistry and science). I often spot fake numbers, shows, events and on the internet. Not everyone likes to hear this or get this news. Its also not unheard of to have people call you out when in fact your numbers ARE legit.
One of the things you have to watch for is Letters and numbers sizing and Fonts. Different companies used different fonts and sizes. Sometimes over the years they changed as well. It is tell tale to see a later years font or wrong size on a vehicle that is much earlier.
Sometimes you can see obvious signs of welding or grinding. I also worked in the casting business off and on, and know many tool and die makers. These guys get really upset to be called machinists by the way. Whole different skill set and level of expertise. Most early British stuff was Sand Cast, same with HD, Indian and others but by and large, most went to Die casting.
Early CB750 Hondas that were Sandcast models command huge premiums and a knowledgeable buyer knows how to spot the differences but can be several thousand $$$ difference. I have an idea who those guys with the mold might have been but thats only part of the equation. It takes a lot of skill and knowledge to produce a useable casting. I know of a scrap yard where several dozen engine castings seeming brand new were found. No vin numbers and some still needed finish machining.
They make nice mockups and display motors but junk for real use. They used wrong alloy and heat treat and the castings were so soft the threads would pull out let along bearings and races. I know where theres several guys with a pile of NOS Harley and Buell castings for their racing programs. These are the Heavy duty castings and specially modified so gearing and drivetrain parts can be swapped quickly and easily. A true bargain and I bought a set just for display.
I dont know if we will ever use them. Here in Oregon and Washington, and sometimes California you can also get an “Assigned” Vin Number. This is sometimes a special sticker, and sometimes a foil or alloy plate and is attch by either the State Police or a DMV employee. I have a few vehicles with these along with the documentation.
Oregon is trying to get away from that. I am currently Feuding with Oregon DMV headquarters as for vehicles with lost titles, they want to do a “Assembled vehicle title” Thats A-OK-Fine for a basket case or project from misc sources Such as my parts shelves or the last 10 years of swap meet finds but for a vintage vehicle with provenance and history, a Assy vehicle title is stupid and dangerous. I can show the vehicle is numbers correct and left the factory with all these correct parts. But the value of it is only a fraction of fair market value if its an Assembled vehicle title. Been dealing with this for several years. That IS the problem with hiring people with no real actual knowledge and experience in motor vehicles and allowing them to determine policy and procedures. BY LAW, I can point you guys online to the Oregon Revised Statues (ORS) that mandate that unless there is a preponderance of evidence showing alteration or fraud, The dept of Motor vehicles is REQUIRED to register and title vehicles.
Its in black and white and its the law. I can bring in a BOS on a brown paper grocery sack and you HAVE to issue me a title. Now, it takes a bit more finesse. But hopefully you understand my point here. Trusting govt employees to make rational and practical decisions can be a trying experience.
Thats why up until a few days ago we had armed protestors here in Oregon in a standoff with the feds. I didnt agree with many of their points, but I do understand their anger and frustration. I worked for 3 different Govt agencies so, I saw the problems from both sides.
Funny stroy real quick and Ill get off my soap box. When I worked for Precision Castparts (PCC aka Pretty close castparts) which primarily makes aerospace stuff but does do medical parts and all kinds of industrial stuff, I at one point transferred into a dept for Engineering development and one off specialty projects. Many of the prev employees had been fired. What had happened was a special limited production run of custom pistols came thru. Based on the famous Desert Eagles these were stainless steel of a proprietary formula we had.
(Stainless Steel can be many different flavors and varieties. We did specialty custom stuff) There was a a batch of either 50 or 100, dont recall exact number but they were nearly completed and only needed 1 machining operation before end of month ship. They still needed some parts installed but this was common off the shelf parts that interchange such as grips and other bits.
NONE of these guns had makers marks, or serial numbers engraved yet. Someone on weekend overtime stole the whole lot. Somewhere out there someone built up a stash of some VERY special hand guns.
Now, I have 4 very special prototype engines sitting here. Brand new, IN the wrapping, Sourced 3rd party legally.
There was a company producing these engines for a world wide known manufacturer on a contract basis. There was a dispute over money. Allegedly there was 50 or 75 motors sitting on that shipping dock.
I know legally own 4 of them. So, stuff happens. The issue is, what happens down the road. Where does this stuff end up???
Locate the Gun Serial Number The serial number can be found in many different locations. Typically the serial number can be found on the handle, slide, trigger guard or receiver. There is no typical serial number. For example, a Browning serial number can range in length from eight to ten characters, a Glock number is only five characters long. Serial numbers can contain both numbers and letters. A serial number is stamped in metal so it doesn't wear easily.
If a serial number is worn, try looking for the serial number in a different place on the gun (some guns will have more than one serial number). A worn or filed-off serial number is an indicator of a stolen gun. Contact the Manufacturer Call the gun manufacturer or go to the manufacturer's website to access their online search tool. There is no central resource for gun manufacturers. See Resources for the gun manufacturer's online directory of many gun manufacturer websites.
For lesser-known manufacturers, you can conduct a search online or look at your user manual for contact information. Submit the gun serial number to the representative over the phone or enter it into the search field online. Write down the gun manufacturing date and the gun model as provided by the representative or online search tool.
Gun History Check the search tool in the state where you purchased the gun. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement agencies, for instance, provides a free online search tool. If that gun is reported stolen, the search tool will display that information. You can conduct a search online for checking firearm serial numbers in your state, or go directly to the police department as described in step two. Visit Your Local Police Department Give the officer the gun serial number and ask him to run a check on the gun. If the gun was ever reported stolen anywhere in the United States, the officer will be able to tell you.
The police department will run the gun's serial number through the FBI's NCIC database which records all stolen guns that have been reported in every state. Go Online Enter the serial number into a third-party website like HotGunz or StolenWeapon. A gun owner may register the gun with one of these sites after he realizes that it is stolen.
These sites, therefore, can only tell you if the gun has been previously registered to them as stolen, not if the gun has been reported stolen to a law enforcement agency.
August 8, 2016 Background Checks for Guns. NRA opposes expanding firearm background check systems, because background checks don’t stop criminals from getting firearms, because some proposals to do so would deprive individuals of due process of law, and because NRA opposes firearm registration. Background checks don’t necessarily stop criminals from getting firearms. Federal studies have repeatedly found that persons imprisoned for firearm crimes get their firearms mostly through theft, the black market, or family members or friends. Less than one percent get guns at gun shows. (Bureau of Justice Statistics). Most mass shooters, including those inspired by Islamic terrorist groups, pass background checks to acquire firearms.
ATF has said that nearly half of illegally trafficked firearms originate with 'straw purchasers'—people who pass background checks to buy firearms for criminals. The terrorists who attacked in San Bernardino in 2015 allegedly got firearms from a straw purchaser who passed a background check.
Federal law requires firearm dealers, regardless of location, to initiate a background check before selling or otherwise transferring a firearm to a person who is not a dealer. There is no “gun show loophole.” Federal law is the same, regardless of where a firearm sale takes place. There is no “online sales” loophole. Federal law is the same, regardless of how people communicate about selling/buying a firearm. Federal law prohibits anyone— licensed firearm dealer or not—from shipping a firearm to a person who lives in another state, unless that person is also a dealer. Dealers must document all firearms they receive.
There is no “Charleston loophole.” The National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) has three days to determine whether a person is prohibited from acquiring a firearm, to prevent arbitrary delays. If the FBI thereafter determines the person is prohibited, ATF recovers any gun inappropriately transferred.
Federal law requires all firearm dealers to be licensed and to initiate a background check before transferring a firearm to a non-dealer,regardless of where the transfer takes place. Background checks for firearms have been conducted through the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) since November 1998. However, background checks don’t stop criminals from stealing firearms, getting them on the black market, or getting them from straw purchasers.
According to the Department of Justice (DOJ), 77 percent of criminals in state prison for firearm crimes get firearms through theft, on the black market, from a drug dealer or “on the street,” or from family members and friends, while less than one percent get firearms from dealers or non-dealers at gun shows. A study by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) of armed career criminals showed that while 79 percent had acquired their firearms from “off the street” sales, “criminal acts,” and relatives, only six percent had acquired firearms from dealers or non-dealers at gun shows and flea markets. According to the DOJ, “about 1.4 million guns, or an annual average of 232,400, were stolen during burglaries and other property crimes in the six-year period from 2005 through 2010.”The FBI’s stolen firearm file contained over two million reports as of March 1995. ATF has said, “Those that steal firearms commit violent crimes with stolen guns, transfer stolen firearms to others who commit crimes, and create an unregulated secondary market for firearms, including a market for those who are prohibited by law from possessing a gun.” Even gun control supporters have said, “approximately 500,000 guns are stolen each year from private citizens.
Obviously, these stolen guns go directly into the hands of criminals.” A study conducted by gun control supporters found that in 1994, “about 211,000 handguns and 382,000 long guns were stolen in noncommercial thefts that year, for a total of 593,000 stolen firearms.” ATF has reported, “the most frequent type of trafficking channel identified in ATF investigations is straw purchasing from federally licensed firearms dealers. Nearly 50 percent.” Criminals defeat the background check system by getting guns through straw purchasers.The terrorists who attacked in San Bernardino, California, in December 2015, used firearms they acquired through an alleged straw purchaser. According to the nation’s leading criminologist specializing in the study of murder, “Most mass murderers do not have criminal records or a history of psychiatric hospitalization.
They would not be disqualified from purchasing their weapons legally. Certainly, people cannot be denied their Second Amendment rights just because they look strange or act in an odd manner. Besides, mass killers could always find an alternative way of securing the needed weaponry, even if they had to steal from family members or friends. None of the mass shootings that President Barack Obama named in a White House speech on gun control in January 2016, would have been prevented by requiring background checks on private sales of firearms. Gun control supporters are not being honest Background checks are not “the most important thing we can do.” Michael Bloomberg’s gun control group says, “The single most important thing we can do to reduce gun violence is to require a criminal background check for every gun sale.”The statement is preposterous. Since 1991, when the nation’s violent crime rate hit an all-time high, violent crime has been cut by more than half, as gun control has been eliminated or ameliorated at the federal, state, and local levels. Most experts attribute the decrease in crime to economic factors, improved policing programs, the reduction in the crack cocaine trade, increased incarceration rates, and other factors unrelated to gun control. The FBI doesn’t include gun ownership or gun control in its list of crime factors.
There is no “gun show loophole.”Since 1994, federal law has required dealers to initiate a background check before selling or otherwise transferring a firearm, whether at a gun show or anywhere else. “Loophole” is a phony term.The Gun Control Act (1968) and the Brady Act (1993), written and voted for by gun control supporters, expressly impose record-keeping and background check requirements on firearm dealers, manufacturers, and importers alone. Notes: The Gun Control Act (1968), requires anyone “engaged in the business” of manufacturing, importing or dealing in firearms to be licensed. The Firearms Owners Protection Act (1986), stipulates that “engaged in the business,” “as applied to a dealer in firearms,” refers to. “a person who devotes time, attention, and labor to dealing in firearms as a regular course of trade or business with the principal objective of livelihood and profit through the repetitive purchase and resale of firearms, but such term shall not include a person who makes occasional sales, exchanges, or purchases of firearms for the enhancement of a personal collection or for a hobby, or who sells all or part of his personal collection of firearms.” The background check requirement is established. Checks are required on non-dealers other than those in certain states, who have certain kinds of firearm permits (see Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, ) and those who have already passed an FBI background check to acquire a firearm regulated by the National Firearms Act. Under, a dealer may conduct business at gun shows and similar events, but the background check requirement in paragraph (t) still applies.
The Brady Act was enacted on November 30, 1993, and took effect on February 28, 1994. It initially required that firearm dealers inform the relevant state or local law enforcement agency of a person’s intention to acquire a handgun, and required that said agency conduct a background check on the individual within five state government business days. The Supreme Court struck down the latter requirement on Tenth Amendment grounds in (1997). The Act further required that as of November 30, 1998, the handgun check/waiting period requirement would cease, in favor of what is now known as the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS). Michael Planty and Jennifer Truman, Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS), May 2013, p. See also Marianne W. Trey anastasio traveler rapidshare free download.
Stolen Firearm Serial Number Lookup
Zawitz, BJS, July 1995; Caroline Wolf Harlow, BJS, November 2001. In 1985, the Department of Justice reported that only about one in five convicted felons obtained guns through legal channels such as retail stores.
(“Few criminals get guns through legal channels,” The Spokesman-Review, October 14, 1985.) ATF, March 1992, p. Lynn Langton, BJS, November 2012, p. Note 5, Zawitz. ATF, June 17, 2013, p. Bloomberg School of Public Health, no date.
Cook and Jens Ludwig, National Institute of Justice, May 1997. ATF, June 2000, p. Another reason a criminal might use a straw purchaser is to avoid being recorded as the buyer of the firearm, on the federal Form 4473 that records the identity of the buyer and the make, model and serial number of the firearm being acquired. Richard Winton and James Queally,” Los Angeles Times, December 30, 2015.
“Prosecutors modified the charges against Marquez, claiming he made false statements when obtaining each of the semiautomatic rifles used in the attack, which were purchased in 2011 and 2012. Attack co-perpetrator Farook had Marquez acquire the weapons because he feared he would not pass a background check, investigators have said.” James Alan Fox, criminology professor at Northeastern University,” Boston.com, December 19, 2012.
12/30/11 — 12/20/11 — Missing family member of 34 years has been found alive 12/20/11 — 11/29/11 — Largest Cold Case Investigation in Cook County Sheriff’s Office History 11/23/11 — 11/18/11 — 11/07/11 — 11/04/11 — 10/30/11 — 10/12/11 — Sheriff Dart approves exhumations, DNA tests in an effort to find matches 10/11/11 — 10/11/11 — Teenage son of victims charged last month, now his friends confess to roles 10/04/11 — Sheriff Dart’s latest ruse leads to capture of more than 100 criminals 10/01/11 — Two-day beating and six-day confinement ends when attacker falls asleep.